It’s time to head back to Chicago for the second of six episodes recorded over the Labor Day weekend at the 80th World Science Fiction Convention, following Episode 181’s brunch chat with Wesley Chu.

This episode’s guest is Carol Tilley, a professor in the School of Information Sciences at the University of Illinois who teaches and writes about comics, libraries, reading, and censorship. We first met six years ago when she was in D.C. to deliver a presentation at the National Archives titled “Dear Sirs: I Believe You’re Wasting Your Time,” during which she shared what she learned about comics readers of the ‘50s while researching the records of the Senate Judiciary Committee’s Subcommittee on Juvenile Delinquency. In her role as a comics historian, she’s made numerous visits to D.C. over the years to research at the Library of Congress and National Archives for  a biography of Fredric Wertham, whose attacks on sex and violence in comics, and particularly his infamous book Seduction the Innocent, helped bring about the Comics Code.

She was interested not just in the inner workings of Wertham — who comics fans, when I first entered fandom, considered a bigger villain than Doctor Octopus and Lex Luthor rolled into one — but also in the experiences of those who read, drew, and engaged with comics in the US during the ’30s-’50s. She came to Worldcon to share what’s she’s learned, and was also going to speak on a panel about the renewed attack on books and curriculum in schools across the U.S.

We discussed how we each first learned about the Comics Code, the mostly forgotten rich kid origins of Blondie‘s Dagwood Bumstead, the unsettling inconsistencies she discovered while going through 200 boxes of Fredric Wertham’s papers, what those documents reveal about how he came to believe what he came to believe, what it means to research with the brain of an historian, the proper pronunciations of Potrzebie and Mxyzptlk, her efforts to track down those who wrote letters to the Senate protesting comic book censorship during the ’50s (including one of the founders of the Firesign Theater), the enduring power of EC’s “Judgment Day,” why she believed comic book censorship would have occurred even without Wertham’s input, what she thinks he’d make of today’s comics, how Wertham felt about the way comic book fans felt about him, and much more.

The setting for this episode was The Purple Pig, a restaurant I hadn’t been to since the last time Worldcon was in Chicago, way back in 2012.

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Here’s what we chowed down on as we chatted —

Carbonara Arancini
Egg Yolk, Guanicale + Creamy Parmesan

Foie Gras & Pig Tail Terrine
Strawberry, Pistachio, Frisee + Brioche

Roasted Carrots
Red Carrot Puree, Cipollini Onions, Almond Dukkah + Yuzu Vinaigrette

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Please join me next time for the third of my meals from the Chicago Worldcon — one with Nebula Award-winning author Eileen Gunn, whose collection Night Shift Plus … was released earlier this year as part of the PM Press Outspoken Authors Series.

Thanks for listening!